the Elias forum: Explore the transcript archive.










Wednesday, December 22, 2004

<  Session 1682 (Private/Phone)  >

“Focus Impressions”

“Conceptualization Experiences”

“Questions About the Kris Material”

Participants: Mary (Michael) and Marta (Bourjn).

(Elias’ arrival time is 16 seconds.)

ELIAS: Good afternoon!

MARTA: Hello! Good afternoon, Elias! And we meet again! (Elias laughs) And how are you?

ELIAS: As always, and yourself?

MARTA: I hope, one day, to be able to say the same thing, “as always.” (Elias laughs)

Since the last time we talked, I had some wonderful objective creations, for example, how true it is that when we choose ourselves, that we create what we really want right now, in the moment. (Elias laughs) I created a wonderful car, exactly the car I wanted, in one day.

ELIAS: Congratulations!

MARTA: It was great to see how effortless everything was created. It was great. No problem, everything was exactly what I wanted. After that, Dora/Arria created a website in the Internet, and this website that is basically oriented about all your information.

ELIAS: Very well.

MARTA: It is basically trying to give a little help to propagate your information on the Internet and give opportunity to other individuals to able to find it. It’s an open forum in which we discuss your information, your material and our experiences. You have been nominated honorary member!

ELIAS: Ha ha! I accept!

MARTA: But I think you have to register! (Both laugh) Just make your presence there once in a while, okay?

ELIAS: Very well.

MARTA: I want first to verify some focuses.

ELIAS: Very well.

MARTA: Margot/Giselle asked you about one creation I had, about Pericles being perhaps one of my focuses. You had said that it was a very close person to him. I connected with Sophocles.


MARTA: Another I connected to was a name like Ehuroa, a weird name. She was a wife or concubine of King Hammurabi in Babylon who bore him two sons.

ELIAS: Correct.

MARTA: Chantal Bouchet, a future focus in France, 2300.

ELIAS: Correct.

MARTA: Now I connected with a focus in which she’s a religious dancer in 800. I thought it was in Bhutan, but then I got the impression that she was more in Malaysia. Which one is the correct one?

ELIAS: The first.

MARTA: The first one, in Bhutan, and her name is Naho-Mi?


MARTA: The other one I connected with was Plotinus, a Roman philosopher who founded Neo-Platonism.

ELIAS: Observing.

MARTA: Francesco Paolini, a scholar in Florence during the 1600s?

ELIAS: Also observing and counterpart.

MARTA: Interesting! I haven’t found too many counterparts. (Elias chuckles) The Irish painter John Boyne?


MARTA: Sir Thomas Mallory, English poet who wrote “The Death of Arthur” in the 15th century?

ELIAS: Observing.

MARTA: Huanicuchalp, an Inca craftsman who worked in poetry and sculpture, 500 BC?


MARTA: Helen or Helena Goryus, a Greek courtesan, 300 BC?


MARTA: This is strange. I got the name “Olympia” and in Cyprus who had a son named Protheus. I think it was about 500 BC.

ELIAS: Correct.

MARTA: Hamide, a belly dancer in Istanbul, 800?

ELIAS: Correct.

MARTA: Praxiteles, the Greek sculptor?

ELIAS: Observing.

MARTA: The focus of Maria Walewska, you told me I was a close person to her. I got the impression I was her uncle.

ELIAS: Yes, you are correct.

MARTA: Is his name Eugene?


MARTA: Now, I was confused with the name. I got (inaudible).

ELIAS: No, that is another focus.

MARTA: I know that I connected with Theophilus, the son of a powerful aristocrat in Crete during the Mycenaean period, who was involved in a sports competition. I think his father was Phidias.

ELIAS: Correct.

MARTA: Francesco Botticelli, the Italian painter born in Florence?

ELIAS: Observing and counterpart.

MARTA: This also I connected to, and I saw everything very clear, St. Pionius, a Greek young martyr who was executed in Smyrna 250 AD.

ELIAS: Correct.

MARTA: Nyclos, a fisherman in Patmos?

ELIAS: Correct.

MARTA: What time?

ELIAS: Your impression?

MARTA: Oh, I didn’t get it this one. I think it was early, very early. It was BC.

ELIAS: Yes, you are correct.

MARTA: But I don’t have the year.

ELIAS: (Chuckles) 300.

MARTA: Coco Channel, the fashion designer, observing essence?


MARTA: Mauli, a Hawaiian man in the 1700s.


MARTA: I connected this other one; I think her name is Lily Legrand, a sophisticated, high-class French courtesan in the 1700s from which Victor Hugo got his inspiration for the novel “Marion Delorme.”

ELIAS: Correct.

MARTA: Xenophila, in Greece, who was involved with the temple of Apollo, 225 BC?

ELIAS: Correct.

MARTA: Dumitru Romanescu, a future focus in Romania 2100?

ELIAS: Correct.

MARTA: Huong So Minh, a Vietnamese girl who died very young.

ELIAS: Correct.

MARTA: I connected with Eleanor de Bohum, in England, who was married to Carter/Cynthia’s focus, Thomas of Gloucester, the Duke of Gloucester, who was the seventh son of King Edward III.

ELIAS: Correct.

MARTA: And Carter/Cynthia’s focus is correct also?

ELIAS: Correct.

MARTA: Now, about the focus I told you about in my last session, Anastasia Romanova, the wife of Ivan the Terrible, you told me I was close to her. I got in meditation that I was her mother.

ELIAS: Yes, you are correct.

MARTA: I got also this connection, Rudolf Hoffman, a German bread baker in the 1800s.


MARTA: Good! This is why I like to bake. (Both laugh) I love to bake pastries and cake. Now, this was a very interesting thing. We were having a chat on the computer with Dawn/Awan, Mark/Baruch, Dora/Arria and me. Suddenly I got this strong impression of a focus of Dawn as Melanie, it was her name focus, and that she was my daughter in England. Then Baruch got involved in the impression also, and said, “Your name is Tobias.”

ELIAS: Correct.

MARTA: I got the impression that Mark/Baruch was our neighbor, he was in love with Awan, and I was opposed to this relation. ELIAS: Correct.

MARTA: Then I got the impression that the last name is Lancaster, Tobias Lancaster.


MARTA: That is correct! (Elias laughs) It was interesting because in came like that, that we got impressions together. Another impression I got, my focus of Ellen Bradfield that was married to Alan Bradfield in England, I got the impression that Alan is a focus of Rob/Niven.


MARTA: Rob/Niven he got the impression that Alan was a blacksmith or working with metal.


MARTA: Dora/Arria had the impression that Rob/Niven was our son in our focus in Scotland, in which I was Donaldina McBride. Then I got impressions that Rob/Niven was our son and his name was Andrew.

ELIAS: Correct.

MARTA: I got an impression myself of a focus of mine, Salim, born in Morocco, and involved in the black-market of mummies at the end of the 19th century.

ELIAS: Correct.

MARTA: Now another, Viala, a focus in the LOTR dimension.


MARTA: I had this impression for a long time, Josephine Bonaparte.

ELIAS: Observing.

MARTA: Is one of my focuses an advisor of Alexander the Great?

ELIAS: Somewhat; briefly.

MARTA: I got the impression that he was a history advisor, not a military advisor.

ELIAS: Correct.

MARTA: The name is something like Calisto, but I don’t have the name correctly.

ELIAS: (Chuckles) And you shall continue in your investigations.

MARTA: Another one I got was Clotilde, I think the last name is Kruger, a laundress woman living in Reims, 1380.

ELIAS: Correct.

MARTA: Now I connected with Bartolome de Las Casas, the Spanish missionary and historian. I got impressions that he’s a focus of your essence and that my focus was a native Indian, Tamara, and I was connected with you. I had an intimate relation with you, I was in love with you, but it was basically like that, only just a relation. Is correct?


MARTA: Another one, Thomasiu Tripolius, a weird name, a Roman Briton, 280.

ELIAS: Correct.

MARTA: This is a very recent impression I had: Electra, the daughter of Agamemnon.

ELIAS: Counterpart.

MARTA: Another focus, Iphigenia, a Greek actress known by her performances of Sophocles’ tragedies. It’s in ancient Greece, AD also, but I don’t have the time. Please!

ELIAS: (Chuckles) You shall offer this to yourself in your impressions. You are paying attention quite well.

MARTA: Two hundred AD? I got the impression right now.

ELIAS: Slightly earlier.

MARTA: Marie Therese Lamourous, in France, Bordeaux, who wanted to be a writer, 1860.

ELIAS: Correct.

MARTA: My future focus Maxim Trevors, Myranda had an impression that there is a very strong connection with her focus Myr van Anderson and (inaudible) van Anderson, that is a focus of Patel. She feels that we are cousins.


MARTA: I feel that my two future focuses Maxim Trevors and Akaki are aware of me, of this focus.


MARTA: Now I have questions for Rob/Niven. He wants to know about a presence that he connected with in the projection that he calls (inaudible). Here are his words: “I noticed that (inaudible) is standing next to me, and at this time I get an urge to ask him who he is. At this point, all I see is a huge, bluish eyeball. This image of this eye is massive and occupies all I see at the time, and it’s real. But at this moment I begin to see that it’s either me or it’s Elias.

ELIAS: The latter. MARTA: (Both laugh) Has Rob/Niven focuses with your essence?


MARTA: How many?

ELIAS: Twenty-seven.

MARTA: Rob has a question for you that he asked me please to ask you. He wants to know what are your opinions about the condition of his father. About eight years ago, his father had a heart attack, and he was clinically dead for at least ten minutes. The paramedics shocked him and brought his heart back to life. He was in a coma for a couple of days, and since then has not been the same. Over the course of these four days, he was transformed into a drastically different person. It was almost like he reverted mentally to a five-year-old person from fifty-five. He has lost touch with reality. He doesn’t remember his own name 75 percent of the time, or he doesn’t remember what happened a few minutes ago. He remembers some things about his past but very little, just to name a few things about his condition. Short-term memory, motor skills, everything has been affected. Rob wants to know what is going on.

ELIAS: The individual has chosen to be experiencing the remainder of his focus in a very different manner, and in this, is more focused upon being other focuses of himself than he is in being himself, which is also an action that can be generated in associated with transition, which the individual does engage, transition.

Also, there is another factor involved, in which this individual has chosen to be experiencing the remainder of his focus in a manner in which he generates what you would term to be a more innocent perception.

MARTA: Like a child.

ELIAS: Yes, which allows more mobility in association with movement in and out of other focuses, and allows less constriction in association with movement and interaction as essence with other essences.

MARTA: And I would also say he is more subjectively connecting. I think is he having more subjective movement than objective.


MARTA: This is not a result of his being dead for ten minutes, clinically.

ELIAS: I am understanding, and in a manner of speaking yes, it is, for that was the method that was chosen that would be acceptable to generate this type of...

MARTA: ...this change of behavior. Basically, it is an action that this individual has chosen to proceed in transition in this way. Others choose Alzheimer’s, for example. It’s just a choice.

ELIAS: Correct.

MARTA: Now with my experience, during meditation I decided I wanted to experience a little more understanding about tone. Using my conceptualization inner sense, I had the most peculiar experience. I felt myself suddenly pulsating so strongly. I felt that I was a tremendous, tremendous pulsating energy. It was awesome, because it was humongous. I felt this very, very, very hard. Then I understood that tone is vibration. Suddenly I felt your energy, Elias, and I said to you, “Tone is vibration, but I feel that there is more to that,” and you answer, “Quite, continue your conceptualization experience.”

I continued, and I had the realization that this pulsating energy carried an incredible amount of information, that tone is information. For example, essence has many, many, many different (inaudible) tones, and each focus of attention, or any consciousness, has its own tone and carries the information related to that. So a focus of attention carries all the information related to that focus of attention. For example, if I resonate with a tone, then it means that I share some important information, similar interest, intent, personality, aspect of qualities. There is some kind of resonance, because we share similarities. Correct?

ELIAS: Yes, you are quite correct and quite accurate, in actuality. If you are projecting in layers of consciousness into nonphysical layers of consciousness, this is what you shall experience. You may find it somewhat interesting to be sharing with Michael, for Michael is aware of this experience also for he engages this action and is aware of this pulsing in every session encounter.

MARTA: Also, I understood that a tone can be manifested or translated in countless ways, but the information that it carried would be always the same.


MARTA: It was a nice experience. I love conceptualization!

ELIAS: (Laughs) And I may commend you upon your ability to translate that into language.

MARTA: It’s so hard to translate, Elias. (Elias laughs) When you have an experience, it’s so incredible because you have that understanding. It’s amazing and there is the understanding, but then after, when you try to explain things, it’s horrible. It’s very difficult to explain.

ELIAS: I am aware, but you have accomplished quite well.

MARTA: I feel that my musical tone is the lower A, two octaves below middle C.

ELIAS: Correct.

MARTA: Another experience, again conceptualization, my favorite sense. It is very hard for me to translate in words, as I feel it’s almost impossible to explain it. Whatever I say sounds illogical and paradoxical. I understood that according to which area of awareness – it had to do with essence – we are focused in in essence, it can be said that our essence is not focused physically or even has not fragmented. I experienced what I only can define as an infinite holonic expression – wholes within wholes within wholes. Metaphorically, the only way I can explain it is like the Russian dolls that are one inside the other. They are all nested, but each doll is like one area of awareness that has countless attentions and actions. The next doll will enclose this area but incorporate different actions and focuses, and it goes like that and in my experience has no end. There is no end to essence.

ELIAS: Correct.

MARTA: It’s not an enclosed distance and has no boundaries, but incorporates defined areas of action or awareness. No area is greater or more evolved than any other, just different actions of consciousness (inaudible).

ELIAS: Correct.

MARTA: I’m aware that, for example, those areas that you have defined, Regional Areas 1, 2, 3 and 4, are relevant only to physical dimensions, realities.

ELIAS: Correct.

MARTA: But also you have expressed in one transcript that we could say that it goes to infinite, beyond Area 4.


MARTA: Based on my experience, I have a question. When you said that our essences occupy all areas of consciousness, were you referring only to Regional Areas 1, 2, 3 and 4? Because in my experience, I see no limit about which area essences occupy. In reality, essence occupies all areas of consciousness, any essence. The vastness of essence is unlimited.

ELIAS: Quite! (Laughs)

MARTA: Oh, it was neat! From this experience, I feel that essences essentially don’t belong to any certain group or family. As example, let’s say my essence has aspect focuses in physical dimensions and experiences physicality, but at the same time, paradoxically, it is not.

ELIAS: Correct.

MARTA: It’s hard for me to explain it, but this is what I understood. It’s like one doll (inaudible), and that doll aligns with a group of essences in different physical dimensions. From that point of view, it could be said that it is like some kind of identification or separation, but beyond that my essence is not separated from any other essence. It’s like any identification ends; like my essence, your essence.

ELIAS: Correct. I am quite understanding, and you are offering quite an accurate explanation.

MARTA: This is what is so paradoxical, that from some areas, from some doll, an essence is not focused physically, but another doll from the same essence is still focused physically. And paradoxically, from one doll, my essence has not fragmented.

ELIAS: Correct. As myself as example, I am no longer physically manifesting within your physical dimension, but I also am.

MARTA: Exactly. In the doll that I see you are, you are not focused physically, but still, from my doll, you are focused physically, because your focuses are all simultaneous.

ELIAS: Correct.

MARTA: Then, after I had this experience, I was reading one transcript that said “beyond what is identified as Regional Area 4, we incorporate a genuine expression of no separation, and therefore, there are no distinctions, so to speak, of essence, for essence is consciousness and consciousness is not a thing. Therefore, there is nothing to be separated.”

ELIAS: Correct.

MARTA: I read this after I had experience; it was awesome. Would it be accurate to say that the grouping of essences as families of consciousness apply only to physical dimensions?

ELIAS: Correct.

MARTA: Elias, has there been any change in the number of focuses of my essence from 827?

ELIAS: And your impression?


ELIAS: Correct.

MARTA: Or my essence tone?


MARTA: My alignment either?


MARTA: My signature essence color you told me is plum. Which one is the color of my focus?

ELIAS: And your impression?

MARTA: Indigo blue.


MARTA: In our last session, we were talking about my experience of focus of attention and the countless points of attention, Martas. Now I’m confused. When a focus of attention, being the designated final focus, does this designation apply to the focus of attention or to one specific point of attention?

ELIAS: That applies to the focus.

MARTA: Also, today I was thinking that when I connect with another focus, how I’m going to know which of all the points of attention I’m going to be with, but then I realized it matters not because all the points of attention are the same focus of attention.

ELIAS: Correct.

MARTA: Now, this is another subject, very different subject that I really want to discuss with you.

ELIAS: Very well.

MARTA: In our last session, I asked you a question about the Kris essence. I asked you if that essence was Sumafi, and you answered no. I said that was also my impression. This portion of my session was transcribed and posted by Dora/Arria in a network board that is owned by Paul/Caroll. This site, in my personal opinion, basically has become a site for Serge/Kris. This post from Dora – it wasn’t me – brought an incredible reaction from Serge and people over there.

This is part of Kris’ comment about my question to you. I’m quoting: “This is also why “Essence-Arria” from your beloved [NWV] forum could not quite pinpoint the Sumafi roots, so she automatically assumed that it was bogus, but we do not blame her short-sightedness.” ... “...if you are also examining some of the audience for Elias they often ask questions that automatically limit answers or demand watered down answers.” (1)

Elias, as you can see, it seems to me that Kris, a warning was not extended enough to know that it was me and not Dora/Arria who asked the question, which I find interesting from an essence who claims what he claims about himself. I want now to formulate some questions more clearly, questions about things I found to be confusing or contradictory with previous information that you had given to us or to me. And please, Elias, I would like that you answer the question fully and not to limit your answer due to my shortsightedness. (Elias laughs loudly) You are laughing, but I had to say it because maybe I’m shortsighted and I don’t know how to formulate questions. Please, do not limit yourself in that, okay?

ELIAS: Very well.

MARTA: Is there a Gaura cluster of consciousness, which has over 1070 families, and is the source, the birthing blueprint cluster, of many other clusters of consciousness, as well as being the source of this group of nine essence families, which, according to Kris, the name is the Taaj cluster? (Pause)

ELIAS: This may be somewhat challenging to respond to, for my response would be somewhat yes and somewhat no. Yes, there are groupings of essences that may be termed as clusters. That is a term that Kris has chosen. I may be acknowledging that there are essences that do group together, but as you have observed in your conceptualization, the grouping together of essences is an action that occurs in association with physical realities, for it is unnecessary to be grouping in other areas of consciousness that are nonphysical, for there is no separation. Therefore, there is no necessity for groups, for all is one.

MARTA: Let me quote exactly what Kris said, and you will have better reference. Kris said, “What we are attempting to continue to describe leads into our area which we have termed the Gaura, our home base if you so desire. This is our belonging to, and as we started describing to Joseph yesterday, indeed this cluster is a very important and significant, because it acts as the birthing blueprint cluster....

“From these, your various dimensions and universes and realities and planes and planets have their source. So the Gaura cluster is a Source Event from which others are engendered. That being the case, we ourselves have briefly described that in a mergence with other essences, we often seed multitudes of dimensions that give birth to many realities and within those realities, many civilizations indeed. The energy that still sustains even those that you consider past civilizations and those we have previously termed proto-ancient civilizations are still maintained and fed energy, because they still continue their existences of spite of the fact that they have moved out of the focus of your present personalities and realities.

“So we ourselves are considered 'essence-source', that psychological womb from which other clusters and their essence families group themselves and pursue their individualistic developments into the fulfillment of all of those values pertinent to their psychological well being.

“In more ancient cultures such as the one we participated in the creation of, the one we referred to as the Rama Civilization, which engendered the entire development of the ancient Ayur Vedic (Vedic) Civilization...” (2)

“In actuality we are one of those source selves that ended up in the Taaj that ended up generating the Seth essence. So you could say that we are Seth III and Seth IV combined, but another expression of it, obviously not through Ruburt.” (3)

Is that correct?

ELIAS: First of all, let me express to you two factors prior to my response of whether it is correct or not correct. One is that the intent of this essence is different from my own. Therefore, the direction of this essence shall also be different from my own. In this, the exchange that occurs between that essence and the physically focused individual is different from that which myself and Michael engage.

Now; in this, there is the potential for some element of distortion.

Now; I am not expressing that in a manner of judgment or to incite any judgment within any of you, for it is not bad or wrong. It is merely different.

MARTA: I guess I want to clarify the question for myself. I have my own interest to know, because of what I perceive, my own impressions.

ELIAS: I am understanding.

Now; in this, it is merely different. I have chosen Michael specifically, for I am aware that Michael incorporates the ability and will allow for my energy and my communication with all of you without any alteration. That is not necessarily entirely the situation with the other essence and the other individual. (Strongly) But I remind you that it is not bad and does not invalidate the information.

Now; as to what is being expressed, it can be viewed as accurate, although I am aware that in the manner that it is being expressed, it incorporates much potential for misunderstanding and for individuals to generate ideas that are not quite accurate. But that once again does not invalidate the information that is being expressed, for...

MARTA: From my point of view and for what I want, is this correct that there is a huge cluster from which the blueprints and the birth of all the other clusters, the spring of their birth?

ELIAS: This is what I am expressing to you, in that this incorporates tremendous potential to be misunderstood.

MARTA: Because in my understanding, no essence is the source of another essence, essences merge and fragment by choice, and no essence is giving birth to another essence.

ELIAS: Correct, but in a manner of speaking, I may also express to you that I may be Seth or Seth 3 or Seth 4 or Seth 2, and Seth may be Elias in any aspect, for within consciousness there is no separation. Therefore, there are identifications of what we term to be personality essences, but they also are not separated from each other.

MARTA: And this is what I was experiencing in my conceptualization.

ELIAS: Yes. There are different attentions which may express through layers of consciousness and configure the energy in a manner which fits with the configuration of different areas of consciousness, such as different physical realities, different physical dimensions. But this is what I am expressing, in that this other essence does not incorporate the same direction or intent, so to speak, as do I. I would be incorporating quite different terms in association with these types of conflicts to avoid ideas of absoluteness and to avoid an expression of reinforcing the belief of separation. But that is not to say that the information that this essence is offering is invalid or incorrect. It is not, it’s merely presented in a manner that allows for the suggestion of misunderstanding.

I may express to you, as consciousness is not a thing but an action, all things spring from that action, which I have expressed many times previously. All things that are manifest spring from no-thing, and therefore, there is no separation or distinction. Therefore, yes, there are what you would term to be groupings of attentions which fit the description of what Kris has offered in the identification of what he terms to be clusters, and in the movement of those attentions, yes, it may be said that that facilitates the initiation of other groupings which create the blueprints for individual physical realities.

But I may express to you, this is the reason that I quite infrequently engage conversation with all of you concerning nonphysical areas of consciousness, for there is a tremendous potential for distortion, misunderstanding, generating absolutes. Also, in association with your physical reality, it is actually not relevant, for you engage THIS physical reality and its blueprint and the beliefs that are expressed and your movement and exploration within this particular physical reality. You may play with impressions and projections and visualizations concerning other physical dimensions and realities, but that is a momentary action also.

The concentration of your focus of attention in this manifestation is concerned with this particular physical reality, and for the most part, other than serving as a validation of you as essence and the vastness of yourself and expanding your awareness of how vast you actually are, rather than viewing yourself as one singular entity, the discussion of other areas of consciousness is almost a moot point, and for the most part, does not incorporate much relevance to your physical reality and what you term to be commonly as your life.

Now; I am understanding that there are many concepts and many different volumes of information that may not necessarily be relevant to your reality or your movement in your reality, but may be of some interest regardless of whether it is relevant or not. It may merely be an expression of curiosity, and there are many individuals within your reality that are interested in these types of curiosities.

MARTA: For me, basically, it is that I want to try to understand as much as I can in my focus. When I find contradiction or confusion, I try to find something that clarifies it.

ELIAS: I am understanding and I am acknowledging of you in your desire to be generating clarity. In this, it is not as black-and-white as it appears, for as I expressed to you earlier, my response to your question can be yes and no.

MARTA: Yes, I think I have the impression already of exactly the meaning of that.

My question to you and the answer about not being Sumafi, I guess I want to go back to that. Kris said that the individual who sensed that we are not actual Sumafi was not a far off the mark, but her own ego construction investment cannot allow her to reach beyond those borders. Then Paul asked Kris if he is belonging to a different cluster called Gaura, Kris said, “Indeed.” “And you’re aligning with ... Sumari/Sumafi/Milumet?” Kris said, “Indeed...” [Later in the session, Kris said,] “Indeed, and now thanks to our coming out of the “cluster closet” (roars of laughter) Laverne and Shirley can run to Elias again for confirmation.” (4)

This sarcastic comment from Kris was referring to Dora and me as Laverne and Shirley, two characters from a TV program.

Kris gives now to many people, even people that have many sessions with you, what he calls the gift of the six-pack – namely, three families to which they belong and three families to which they align.

ELIAS: And I have addressed to this already.

MARTA: You already addressed this to me before?

ELIAS: No, I have addressed to this question with other individuals also, and I have expressed quite clearly I am not offering dispute with this other essence. But I have expressed from the onset in the explanation of these essence families, you all incorporate qualities of ALL of the essence families. You belong to one, you align in each focus with one, but you do incorporate qualities of ALL of the essence families. Therefore, in any particular moment, you may be expressing qualities of a different essence family that may not be the family that you align with. That does not change your alignment. But...

MARTA: Plus our essence has many, many focuses with many different alignments and already is getting this experience of all the alignments.

ELIAS: Correct. Therefore, it is unnecessary to be aligning with more than one family within one focus.

MARTA: Now, Elias, I have another question. You have said that your essence occupies what you have defined as Regional Area 4. You said that this is the area in which the archetypes in association with any action of generating any physical dimension.


MARTA: Also, I read that you mentioned to Vicki/Lawrence once, when she was asking about other focuses in another dimension beside this one, if there are other essence families. You answered yes, with the pool of consciousness which you align with each other of those groups.

ELIAS: Correct.

MARTA: Then, it would be accurate to say that your essence is aligned with meaning of the different families of consciousness, not only the nine families that are relevant to this physical dimension.

ELIAS: Correct.

MARTA: Kris has said that your essence, Elias, belongs to the Taaj cluster, meaning the nine families of this dimension, and I see a contradiction.

ELIAS: In one aspect, not in an entirety. Just as in my offering of information concerning my occupation of Regional Area 4, that would be the attentions that involve themselves with you and with other physical dimensions, but I, as essence, in similar manner to yourself, occupy all areas of consciousness.

That information was offered in relevance to your physical dimension for that is relevant to your physical dimension, for that is the area of consciousness which the attentions occupy that directly interact with your...

MARTA: This is why I ask. I realize that no essence belongs to any group of families.

ELIAS: Correct.

MARTA: You don’t belong to a group of family; you align to a group of family, and essence can be aligned to many groups of family.

ELIAS: The term of “belonging to,” once again, is relevant to your physical dimension, your physical reality. It is not as absolute as you interpret it to be at times. It merely is an expression that you, as essence, in association...

MARTA: My example of the dolls.

ELIAS: Yes, for you as essence, in association with this particular dimension, choose to group yourself with a specific group or tribe or family of essences that express the same and similar qualities that you prefer. Therefore, all of your focuses in this particular physical dimension will hold to that preference, but also generate an alignment with different families to experience in different manners.

MARTA: Yes, that’s what he said, but also my essence has focuses in other physical dimensions, not just this one, and in those other physical dimensions that I connected with, they are so different to this one that I assume or think that they are a different group of families, but I might be aligning with the same intent.

ELIAS: Correct.

MARTA: Now the next question: are Michelangelo and Mozart focuses of your essence?


MARTA: Kris said this about Beethoven and Mozart. He said that the source of both are the same, the same essence for Mozart and Beethoven. Then he said that the particular essence that gave rise to these two personalities was not originally from the cluster that gives your nine families of consciousness their source, and that he had, we shall say, traveled to many other different kind of realities to enhance his understating. He’s highly evolved in his own right and has true love and appreciation of every powerful creative drive. Music is not his only interest. Sound is not his only interest. Prior to this, he gave birth to the great creative genius of Michelangelo, and it only interacts with your reality on occasional basis, injecting within highly creative energy with a specific developed personality. It is almost time for another such creative tour into your reality, only every few hundred years of your time, much like a comet, that has come through the psychological skies of your reality.

Well, I see a contradiction with this information. You say that the tone is the focus of attention and that your essence manifested in this dimension over 3000 focuses. I wouldn’t call this occasional interaction. Or it is?

ELIAS: No, and once again this is a window for misunderstanding and distortion. For it is not that the information is inaccurate or invalid, but in the manner in which it is being presented, it lends to tremendous potential for misunderstanding.

It is not a matter of a particular essence. Once again, we are addressing to the issue of separation and the lack of separation. (Strongly) Consciousness is not a thing; it is not an individual; it is not what you term to be a person. Consciousness is not an entity. It does not incorporate gender. Therefore, there is no “he” that inserts or injects into your reality. There is energy, there is action, and that energy is manifest in different time frameworks in what you view as exceptional inspirational manifestations, but those manifestations are also a reflection of the consciousness in that time framework associated with your physical reality. It is not one essence that...

MARTA: Like the renaissance period. In the renaissance, there was not only one genius. It was a mass consciousness.

ELIAS: Correct, and in any time framework, the expression of art is a reflection of the collective. It is, in a manner of speaking, another avenue of communication.

MARTA: Anyway, now I’m coming to the point that Mozart and Michelangelo are not focuses of your essence...

ELIAS: Correct.

MARTA: Kris stated, and that Beethoven and Michelangelo are the same essence.

ELIAS: (Strongly) But once again, I must express to you that in another manner of speaking, I can express to you yes, for there is no separation. Therefore, there is no distinction from one...

MARTA: But this was the way that Kris presented...

ELIAS: I am understanding.

MARTA: ...and my question is directly related to the way he presented.

ELIAS: No, these are not focuses of myself.

MARTA: Elias I’m aware that I have my prejudices of belief and understanding. But I feel that I am able to detect distortions, contradictions, in many, many materials that other people don’t detect. I don’t know, but perhaps it’s my Sumafiness. Do you verify that?


MARTA: Okay. (Telephone abruptly disconnects.)

Session ends after 1 hour, 8 minutes.


(1) From “Kris on Kris,” June 21, 2004.

(2) From “More on the Gaura Cluster and Kris,” June 28, 2004.

(3) From “Kris on Kris,” June 21, 2004.

(4) From “Kris on Kris,” June 21, 2004.

< Previous session | Go to the top | Next session >

© 2004 Mary Ennis, All Rights Reserved.